Global PLEX Market Dev Chat with CCP Rattati, CCP Swift and CCP Monty
EVE Online: CCP plant globalen PLEX-Markt zur Vereinfachung des Handels
EVE Online plant einen globalen PLEX-Markt, um den Handel zu vereinfachen und Investitionen zu fördern. PLEX soll als echte Währung etabliert werden, was höhere Liquidität und stabilere Preise erfordert. Der Zugang zu PLEX wird vereinfacht, um Betrug zu minimieren und den Handel zu erleichtern. Auch die Möglichkeit des globalen Handels mit anderen Gegenständen wird geprüft.
EVE Online
00:00:00
00:05:57 Welcome, we're here today to discuss a little bit about the recent updates announced in last week's DevBlog. I'm CCPMotti and I'm joined by CCPRatati and CCPSwift. Welcome guys. Thank you very much. Yeah, nice. You've been in the studio, right? Before the new studio that we're using. Yeah, I love it. It's amazing. It's a cool little space for us to like just hang out and talk about EVE stuff and just kind of...
00:06:21 Es ist eine gute Möglichkeit, es zu tun.
Historischer Kontext und Definitionen des PLEX-Marktes
00:06:50
00:06:50 To everybody what that is. Yeah, there's a long history around the Plex market. So, CCP, basically, before everyone else introduced this concept of trading a token for subscription. This is way back, probably, what, 15 years ago? Yeah, somewhere around there. Even before World of Warcraft, but World of Warcraft and Blizzard actually kind of jumped on it two years later or something like this. I remember going to the local...
00:07:19 Computer Store before that, buying scratch cards. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. That basically was the kind of idea around it. It's just legalizing that. Can you imagine not being able to log into your favorite video game? Because the shipment of scratch cards with codes did not arrive before the weekend. So one thing that just came up on my social was, do you remember this kind of moment where everyone had these...
00:07:46 It was called TV Station 2 in Iceland. So we only had the one and then we had TV Station 2. It was a private company and they had to do these decoders. So you'd get a decoder and then you would get in the mail like an 18 kind of like digit thing where you're just like, okay, this is your monthly subscription. You have to type it into the decoder like 1, 8, 7, 6. But sometimes you get lucky and...
00:08:14 Und dann hat er die Decoder nicht mehr refreshiert. Das war die beste Sache. Wait, sind Sie old genug zu haben, die Videogames als Texte zu haben? Und dann haben Sie einen Mann gesagt, dass er ein Mann sagt, dass er ein Buch hat und die Programme, ja. Ja, ja, ja. Syncler Spectrum war das eine. So, meine Frau ist eigentlich nicht das, aber sie ist älter als ich.
00:08:41 So, she did that, and I didn't, because it was kind of like pre-my-time. I had an Amstrad, didn't code anything on it, but everyone who had a Sinclair Spectrum, usually, like, I think they got like a coding book to create some code and a game. It's wild. Yeah. It's crazy how, like, technology, just even in gaming, has progressed in just like a couple short years.
00:09:03 Only a few short decades. And if you think that's crazy, we've already done a segment way out of what we're going to do, and I love it. But yeah, back to the global Plex market and the whole history of it. Yeah, so the components are, we have this token you can trade for subscription. And Plex was basically introduction. 500 Plex meant you could buy a one-month subscription.
00:09:30 Then Plex became more of a digital currency for loads of services, what we call utility goods in this blog. So in the blog, we tried to define a lot of this history that has never been defined. So it's really going into like, okay, a lot of this happened over time, but we never put a word to it, a description of it, like definitions of it. So kind of...
00:09:54 Abstracting everything, putting it in perspective, giving the context of like, okay, this is kind of what we're doing. We never really explained everything. So this blog is kind of a historical review, but also trying to set the record straight of how we want to approach it. So it's defining our monetization strategy. This is something we talked about at FanFest to kind of just have more open, honest communication about the things we're doing. We have had a couple of monetization dev blogs recently.
00:10:23 And this is just one more so that we can debate the actual things we're talking about rather than kind of imagined or perceived, let's say. So this is all about Plex. Plex is a digital currency that is connected to real world money. It's the only thing really that's connected to real world money. And it's a highly traded item as well.
00:10:47 Yes, absolutely. I mean, it is part currency, part asset somehow in the core gameplay of it. Yeah, and even investment too. It's one of the core investments that players make. It's like there's three things I hold, coffee, gold and plex. Yeah, it's the safest investment for sure. It's like buying gold. And we want to basically level it up a bit, have it become an actual currency, closer to an actual currency.
00:11:13 So, when we talk about in the blog more liquidity, fairer pricing or like more stable pricing, it's basically the idea that more supply and more demand, they approximate the fairest prices quickly. But today we have this issue of supply being regional and a lot of the trade is actually happening through contracts.
00:11:38 We're not going to solve everything at the same time, but the most important thing is to try to increase liquidity, which means to increase the supply. And we don't want everyone that wants to buy Plex or to sell Plex to actually have to travel to Jita or one of the four hubs. We just want to be on demand. I need some Plex, can I just get some Plex? It shouldn't be that hard. I kind of love the fact that in the video game I love and play every day, I can use...
00:12:07 Jump Drives, Banking use Dark Gates, but internet banking? No. No, no, that's forbidden. So I think the idea here is then in the devlog, we try to kind of abstract things like what's a currency, what's a digital item, what makes sense in our universe to be able to transfer freely versus what are kind of real world commodities that like have intrinsic value and are...
00:12:36 Let's say, combat. I don't know. They have a pay-to-win aspect to it. You don't want to teleport some things around the universe because they need to have risk involved in moving them, hauling them across the universe. These are the real-world items, the things that players make. CCP makes Plex. CCP makes a lot of things, and a lot of them actually contribute nothing to...
00:13:05 So we are trying to do this. We did a couple of attempts of Venn diagrams of physical items, real world items, digital. This is the best we did. It's good enough to explain enough. It's not like a perfect matrix. There's no diagram that just explains everything. But the core concepts are there. And we want to be able to use these definitions to go forward to explain why we're...
00:13:33 Ja, we talk to the players about it as well. We want to make sure everyone's got a level playing field, which I think is super important, of just knowledge of what we refer to things as, what we view things as, and stuff like that. So no one has to make a weird assumption like, oh, CSB did this. This is probably what they meant by it. And then we kind of lose the entire good bones of the conversation that way. I think it's also worth noting.
Vereinfachung des PLEX-Handels und Beseitigung von Hindernissen
00:14:00
00:14:00 Ich sagte das letzte Mal, ich bin ein returninger Spieler zu EVE. Interacting mit Plex in der wie die Plexe in den letzten Jahren war etwas ganz neu zu mir. Und ich war wirklich glücklich, wenn ich über das und ich erzähle euch über das, das in der Chat, dass der ganze Prozess der Plex in einer Plex Vault, dann in der Inventory, dann ist es stressvoll.
00:14:29 So in my mind, this change to actually just make this more streamlined makes perfect sense. Just to remove that friction. When we have something that's connected to real world currency, that that is not an item that is maybe as easily scammed or manipulated or something like that as many others. Exactly. There's a lot of that.
00:14:58 You don't want to play with that item, I think, specifically. So I think that's, and that's on the, that basically on the same path as we're doing is like, okay, let's try to simplify life for new players also. Like, there's a lot of complexity. We don't need to, and fear of, let's say, being scammed generally, because like now Eve has this brand that like, it's a place where people scam you.
00:15:26 und Grief you und Gank you, etc. Es ist gut genug, dass du auch nicht wirklich realen Geld hast. So ich denke, das ist eine solche Dinge, die wir versuchen, Leute zu machen. Ich denke, das ist auch eine lustige Sache, dass es, dass es, insofern es wird, dass es die Plexe-Market von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem, von einem.
00:15:51 Ich habe ein Gefühl, und ich bin kein Game Design oder etwas wie das, das ist einfach nur von mir persönlich, dass wir vielleicht mehr Spieler participate in Investitionen, wenn es um ihre Plags gibt. Denn es ist central, es ist etwas, was ich kann überall machen. Es ist nicht etwas, was ich in einem bestimmten Charakter, in einem bestimmten Ort, um zu participate in eine bestimmte Form von Marktstab. So, ich denke, das würde...
00:16:16 Could be an interesting thing and probably a little bit slower movements, you know, when it comes to its forex trading rather than, you know, something else. I think that's like part of the long-term vision is to start treating all currencies more as a foreign exchange, but with like the regulations we need, we don't want everything to be like perfectly tradable, but there are some things where we might want to kind of ease.
00:16:42 You could call it like in the 80s and 90s, there was like a lot of deregulation around like moving capital, like getting capital, like actually doing something with that as return investment. So investing in rather than just like safekeeping currency. So in loads of cases, you have what's called like almost dead money. That's too little to actually make a difference. So there's a lot of people who have like a fewplex. Yeah, exactly.
00:17:10 No one really wants to buy 7 Plex and then 20 Plex. And like, it's just like a, it's a hassle. So, especially if you travel to do so, to sell your 50 Plex or whatever you got from the daily goals or like any kind of seasonal reward or whatever. So I think this will enable people to just like, okay, get rid of this stuff. However or whenever.
00:17:34 Also, it was partly there already. It was just people had to know that they could essentially inject the Plex into their vault. Yeah, exactly. So basically seasoned or veteran players would know while, yeah, exactly. Functionally, like, just as Susie B. Rattari was saying, like buying Plex, it was super easy to do. You just make it Alt in Gita, which is like a little clumsy, but I think EVE players get used to that just for checking prices. Everybody has an Alt in Gita. Yeah.
00:18:00 But when you're talking about selling it, especially if you've got small amounts, that's where things like your skills come into account. So you can't necessarily just throw it to your alt to sell five or ten plex here and there. So you just end up hoarding it a little bit or holding on to it. And then you're just kind of sitting idle in these wallets. Now there's like a little bit more incentive. If you do have these skills, your like trading skills, you can then list this stuff without like a huge without worrying about the penalties because like.
00:18:29 So if you don't have your skills max, you don't have your standings maxed, then you're already losing out. So it's just like, oh, hold on to it for a rainy day. And then there's that mentality as well. Like, what if I want to make a skin? What if I want to buy something in the New Eden store? Like, if I'm not next to a market like Jita.
00:18:52 Then I'm going to need some sort of stockpile of Plex. Like that's at least my mentality as a player is I always keep a few hundred Plex in my wallet in case I want to just like buy something. And I know I'm not going to be able to bounce back to Cheetah. So now that's just going to be, I'll be able to pop on the market, grab the lowest price, no matter where I am, goes in. I won't have to worry about holding on to like two or 300 at all times. But that's also survivor's bias. Yeah.
00:19:17 Everyone has an alt, not the people who quit before they figured stuff out. Exactly, yeah. So I think that's also... I'm always wary of the... That's how we do it in EVE, because we're missing out of people who just miss those things. I think I mentioned also, contracts are a scary thing. Let's say you come from World of Warcraft, there's a play market, and you just kind of inherently trust the play market, like it's buy and sell. Contracts...
00:19:45 Okay, es ist Spieler-to-Player, aber es ist nicht ein Handshake-Thinge, wie du in Ironforge machst, wo du das Ding in und pressen Yes. Es ist eher wie, oh, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am ich, am
00:20:09 Es ist nicht wirklich ein Application, oder es ist ein System, du musst du einfach nachdenken. Ja. Und regionalen und such. Und obwohl es viele Warnungen gibt, es ist wie, oh, das ist 85 Billion, nicht 85 Million, das ist noch da. Es ist noch da. Ich habe mich auf den Kontrakt System aufhören. Das ist nur weil du so positiv bist. Da sind so viele EVE-Player sind einfach zu smart. Sie finden diese weird Interaktions.
00:20:38 When they were developing the contract system 20-some years ago, no one was thinking of how are players going to screw each other using this system. Nope. But I've quickly learned that we have to think about a lot of these things and we can't think about all of them. That's absolutely the case. We're talking about this now in regards to Plex. But friction-free trade is a term that I've seen thrown around quite a bit.
Visionen für die Zukunft des Handels und der Gegenstände in EVE Online
00:21:07
00:21:07 Maybe more of a philosophy than something else. But why not more items like this? And what could we potentially see moving there in the future? So I think that's absolutely the idea, is to figure out what makes sense in the economy. Like we don't want to break anything, but we do want to simplify things. And there's a few listed items. I think there's a currency aspect that we can deep dive into.
00:21:37 Und da gibt es auch diese Physikalität, Digital Item, Dinge, die wir in die Konsequenzen sind, speziell Cosmetics, ich würde sagen. Sie sind quasi Digital oder Physical Items. Für mich ist es ein Cosmetic Item, weil du basically jump-cloning bist, du machst, es bedeutet, dass du 3D-Print deinem clothes, woher du bist. Es ist einfach nicht...
00:22:01 Ja, Sissibiratati downloads his clothes. Ja, so just like, no, I have to jump, like, to my home station to pick up my pants, just like, does not make sense in the future. Yeah, my body gets printed with my mind just thrown in there. Ah, but my pants, I gotta go back for my pants. Am I gonna stand up in this, I guess, that's for sure. In my head, you basically own a license to print pants, whatever you want.
00:22:29 Das ist was passiert. Ihr Padsprinting License. Und was muss passieren, dass wir ein Konvert-to-Digital-Item machen können und dann haben wir ein Clothes Vault oder ein Wardrobe oder etwas. Das ist die easieste Sache zu tun in der Welt, conceptually. Technically, wir versuchen das zu tun. Aber das sind, für mich, die easy, obvious wins.
00:22:56 I think there are things like the sequencers. They should just be a commodity. There's no reason to have like a skin sequencing item that's restricted to JITA. We see that it's kind of limiting the creation of skins in the first place. So the idea was always to have this as a commodity, easy to access, easy to get, but it just isn't panning out this way. So we'll figure that out. I think that's an easy...
00:23:25 There's no contention that that makes sense because it's not pay to win. Who cares? And then I think the bigger aspirational goal is like, isn't skill extraction very weird? Like to me, skill points are a currency. It's just a currency that you trade over time. We allowed the trade anyway. So why are we doing 400,000 skill points and 800,000 skill points? Very abstract. Why can't I just get?
00:23:54 75,000 skill points that I need. Or a specific skill. Yes. Or a skill, whatever. Just like on demand. Not from CCP. Still from players. But just like make it easier than go buy, skill, inject. Just have a slider in something that says like I need this many skill points. They're all player made. Just let me inject them. It's fine. I think that's the obvious thing. And I like the idea of just like paying with whatever I have. So let's say you have a...
00:24:22 You're in the market, you want to buy a Marauder, and it just says, like, which currency you want to pay in. Do you want to pay in IS? Do you want to pay in Plex? Do you want to pay in SkillPoints? Like, they're all interchangeable anyway. They're just, like, super difficult to figure out the right exchange rate. You can sell the SkillInjector on the market and get the money, but buy a Plex. Like, it's all there. It's just, like, removing that bullshit, saying, like, here, it's easy to do. And it's very dystopian and it's really cool.
00:24:51 Und ich erinnere mich einfach zu kaufen Milch für Blood. Das ist so, wie ich finde es. Geh zu Kronon, unsere lokalen Store, und einfach pay mit DNA oder so. Wenn du das machst, ich bringe eine Kamera. Für die Gemeinschaft. Ja, ich denke, es macht einfach Sinn. Und Hilmar will anfangen zu schreiben Poems und Blood. Ja, warum nicht? Ja. Ich glaube nicht, aber ich verstehe die Idee, aber ich verstehe.
00:25:20 But I like the, I really like this theory on, I would like a thought on the skill points. And when you say, the way you say it, skill points are a currency, it's a very, very good point. It's probably the most sought after item in your life. Yes. Yeah. It's what I need most. One of the biggest successes, because like this whole philosophy that you've been talking about, this isn't our first foray into it.
00:25:44 I think one of the most successful things is loyalty points, like being able to trade loyalty points between groups. We've seen just how impactful this is to the ecosystem. It allows corporations to tax their members or even get donations in loyalty points, trade them between one another, turn those into dreads, turn into like crazy massive dread brawls just like a couple weeks ago. And it's had like a tremendous positive impact in that ecosystem.
00:26:13 So I think when we talked about LP taxes first, it was very uncool, like 100%. First of all, it's not a tax, like it's not a CCP tax. It's more like we tried to rename it as tithe, kind of like you paid 10% to the Catholic Church. Like in the olden days, this was more like what do you pay as a membership fee or something like that. Just like the ISK tax isn't a tax, it's a tithe. So I think...
00:26:40 Das hat, wie du gesagt, revolutioniert, wie das Team oder das Spieler-Grupp war, konnte das Geld machen. Es ist das gleiche mit der 5.7-Plexus. Es hat loads von kleinen LP, die du hast, oder durch die Missions, über die Zeit. Du kannst nicht mehr wegnehmen. Du kannst nicht mehr wegnehmen. Du kannst nicht mehr wegnehmen. Und jetzt ist es, weil du, wie bei Trading, du kannst, das in die Investition.
00:27:07 It's just turning wealth, that's capitalism, turning your stuff into something that pays you back. More fun, more or less, not necessarily more money in the future, but being able to use it is the key thing. So LP is a hugely interesting thing. I'm not sure that I want to have the same kind of complete freedom in trading it, because then I feel we've lost something unique.
00:27:35 Out of the game. Otherwise it's just like this. So there has to be some kind of nuance, but like making it easier to do. And we owe some quality of life things for sure in the LP ecosystem. But we have plans around LP, probably like more next year, but they're more about like...
00:28:00 figuring stuff out around this LP tech debt that we have, Trisactual Ledgers, for example. But also just the LP stores. They are one of our oldest content. They hardly get price changes. They hardly get new inventories. There's nothing. It's just been the same for like two decades almost or whenever it was introduced. There's very much a fixed gameplay loop. For those that are getting a lot of LP, they...
00:28:29 Ich denke, wir können ein paar Interesse in den Kapitalisten investieren.
00:28:58 if we start having more dynamic offers, products, etc. in the LP stores. And I also think it kind of sucks from an LP perspective that there's not also just like really cool things that you buy for yourself in LP stores. It always gets reduced to this kind of ISK per hour calculation. There's no aspect of loyalty where you buy a soulbound thing or something where you're actually like, I earned this, I have level 10 rank, I'm standings.
00:29:27 I have a rank. Why don't I get special stuff? Why is it all the same? Yeah, where's my golden megathrone? Because I have something to be with Galate Navy or whatever. Yes, exactly. Something. It could be cosmetic. It doesn't have to be pay to win or anything else. But just like, what is my... How do I show that I'm a loyalist? I've been in the NPC militia, faction militia for like a decade. But I really have nothing to show for it when I'm flying with other pilots. So I think there's a lot of interesting stuff there.
00:29:56 But on that topic, with a global flex market, the other global market we have is obviously the Paragon Hub. I was listening to you chatting with Oz the other day on quite a few of those things. And I find it very interesting because there were questions in there just on the global kind of trade and market and uniqueness of items. Like, you know, I said a golden megathon, the only megathon I would love more.
00:30:25 Es ist die von SWIFT. Ja. Wenn ich ein MADE-by-CCP-SWIFT hätte, würde ich es. Es wäre ein Hanger Queen, wahrscheinlich. Ich denke, das ist ein Traum, das hat sich immer mehr realistisch über die Zeit. Es gibt eine Konversation in der DevBlog, oder eine Explanation, was Singletons sind. Singletons sind basically Unique Items.
00:30:53 die sind eigentlich Unique, in den Database, mit einem UUID, Unique ID. Ja, ein Mutated Item. Und das hat MADE BY, so du hast deine Signature da. Aber 10 Jahre später, wir waren in ein bisschen, oder 20 Jahre später, wir waren in ein bisschen mehr Zeit und Platz von den Databasen.
00:31:19 So it's all about conserving storage, et cetera. Now we have AWS. Everyone has thousands of gigabytes of pictures on Amazon Cloud or whatever. So it's a completely different game for that. So we're not limited by these things anymore. And we also had a namespace kind of like, or like a digit.
00:31:47 We couldn't have infinite numbers. We have now infinite numbers of unique IDs. We'd have to basically not run out of numbers 10 years ago. Now we can basically have infinite numbers. And this is just how databases have evolved. And then you're talking about the unique IDs of items. Yes, of items. Just storing all of them. It could create, because it's been, I mean, forever and been around for a while. We could start playing around with similar stuff to what happens.
00:32:16 Ja, das ist einfach so, wenn du einen ersten Auto hast, und du sagst, oh, ich fand das exact Auto, und es ist etwas, das macht keinen Sinn zu kaufen, weil es ein Schiphocks war dann war, aber ich werde es noch nicht mehr für 10x den Wert der neuen Auto. Ja. Ja. Wenn ich einen Thorax finde, von 2004, würde ich liebe es. Ja, ja, ja. Even in der Original Look, das wäre sogar cooler. Oh, ja. Mit der Dent. Ja, ja. So, so, das ist basically,
00:32:44 If everything were Unique-ID, we'd also blow up the inventory, because that's a lot of unique things. There's like trillions of items in the EVE database. If you couldn't package them all to be like, okay, but these are commodities. These are all the iron scraps. These are all the ships. It's also like you need some conservation, but the idea is to have just a distinction of custom things. Like a custom thing is a multiplexment item.
00:33:12 A custom thing is a player-made skin or an artisan skin. And we can evolve that, but it needs to be like an action to convert something on purpose into a... It becomes a handcrafted kind of thing. Yeah, mastercrafted, handcrafted or something, yes. Does it get a bonus? I'd be wary of that, but I don't know. It could. I'd pay a premium for a...
00:33:39 0.something percent increase. But that's just a muted item, right? Yeah, but it's handcrafted by somebody who is... Yeah, yeah. Maybe the way there, you need to have crafted 500 of this item or depending on the size of it. It would be a super interesting kind of way forward. So you're basically like at the center of this is that how do you treat these handcrafted items or mastercrafted items because you can't stack them today. So...
00:34:07 We still haven't found a way to stack these. You don't stack handcrafted stuff anyway. Yeah, but what if it's ammo? You can't create a stack of mutated ammo, for example. So that is also stopping the adoption because you can't have a predictable supply or inventory of this mastercrafted thing. So it becomes more of a specialist, super kind of...
00:34:32 Hard PvE, Top Tier Abyssals, whatever. So it becomes only the playground of the Masters in some way. But I think there's a way to kind of bring it down to the more common usage to have more fun with this. So that's something that we can entertain for sure. But other Singletons are like Packet Ships.
00:34:56 und die Artisan Skins. So, wir sind einfach nur ein neues Typen, um zu finden, wie sie... Es ist ein Layering, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer, es ist ein Layer.
00:35:24 als einfach nur eine kleine kleine kleine Böcke in der Fichting-Wintow. In der Kontext von einem Schiff, kann man den coolen Fichtings finden, wie die Skins oder was. So, da gibt es ein Case, dass eine Menge unserer Gameplay ist, dass es so tief ist, so hart zu finden. Und dann, wenn wir abstracken, dass wir nicht das in der Kleine machen, sondern wir machen das Pfeife oder so.
00:35:52 I want to level the playing ground for like more people just interacting with contracts and stuff like this. So they actually get into the like real gameplay. You bring up a really good point. Like players are really good at kind of showing us who the amazing tools that they make, kind of the appetite that they have for certain things. Like players have made like an abyssal mutoplasmic marketplace. That's kind of like, it's a bit clunky because it's linked through contracts.
00:36:19 And you have to kind of know that it's in there to be able to look for it. Like I don't think a newer player and there's nowhere in the NPE that shows like, oh, if you want to mutate these items and you get really lucky, you can trade it over here. And that's where you find the marketplace. So like, you know, ship fittings. That's cool gameplay. Yeah, there are guides for that out there and just like a whole bunch of different things. There was LP trading that was very clunky and ghetto where players would like be in just a chat channel and be like, hey, I've got million Concord LP.
00:36:48 I want three Megatron, not fed, that would be amazing, Navy Megatron BPCs, I'll trade you a little bit of whatever this is in there. So it was clunky, but there was an appetite for it, because people really wanted it. Yeah, I always remember back when I started playing year one of EVE.
00:37:11 Du hast die Killmails mit Fitts, aber ich hatte keine Ahnung, was ich war. Ich würde einfach fragen und fragen, wie ich das mache. Und ich war immer noch hoping für eine Blackbox-Karte-Karte-Karte, wo ich rückwärts die Geheimnisse des Schicks. Und ich könnte das schnauern. Oh, ich habe Rattati's Blackbox von Dominik. Ist das eine Fitt, die Leute wollen?
00:37:37 Pay something to know what is on there. I always find that really intriguing, but at the same time...
00:37:44 Ich liebe es für neue Spieler, zum Beispiel, zu kommen und zu sein, weil sie nicht wissen, was zu sein wird. Aber ich bin ziemlich sicher, dass die zwei von euch mit dem, was ich mit dem. Eine der meisten Dinge, die ich in EVE mache, ist, wenn ich in eine Kriege mit etwas, das sehr unbezüglich ist. Wie, letzte Woche, wir haben eine Retrie, eine normalen Retribution. Armour-plated und Artillier-fit.
00:38:11 Und es war wirklich stark. Und es macht keinen Sinn. Wir hatten keine Ahnung, wie wir es kamen, weil wir nicht verstehen, was wir kämpften. Und es war großartig. Wir haben es geschafft, aber es war wirklich cool. Ich denke, es ist die Idee, die Freiheit zu sein, ja, nicht in der Meta, aber da ist ein Weg zu sein, was du willst, und zu sehen, ob du es funktioniert. Ich liebe die Idee.
00:38:40 Ich glaube, ich gehe gegen die Meta. Ich will das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das, was das.
00:39:09 I don't know that these are cool items. I don't know that these are rare items. So maybe even if it happens to you, like it's cool gameplay, if you mutate an item and you get a really good crit on the roll, you're like, okay, how do I price it? Like, I'm just going to be scammed. Like, there's no, like, it's just like... Yeah, it's super intimidating. It's someone that was like, I was trying to get into this marketplace and I've got 20 years of EA experience. I know what makes a module good.
00:39:35 Aber ich habe keinen Sinn, was ich mache. Das ist wirklich ein Skill für die Leute. Ja, das ist 100 mil oder eine Bill. Ja, das ist 100 mil oder eine Bill. Ja, die Max-Tabs und die... Especially die Low-Slots, die können 10-20 Billion erreichen. Ja, ja. Wie ein Arth Appraiser. Ja, ja, ja, ja.
00:40:02 You can't just Google it, it's whatever it is. There is data to go from, and I'm sure that if you get a big enough data set, there is something that could be done there. But the arts, you know, it's just so much romantic. There's some finesse in it. Mastercrafters and all that. Yeah, I like that. Let's jump back onto where we kicked off with the...
Praktische Auswirkungen der Einführung des globalen PLEX-Marktes
00:40:29
00:40:29 I want to ask a couple of essentially just practical questions. When it comes to market orders, contracts, stuff like that, that's already up, what happens when this gets introduced? So the existing market orders that exist, so contracts aren't going to change, as Tadi was saying, but existing market orders that are up.
00:40:52 They'll all get canceled on the day of the patch when this code gets implemented. And we'll let you know like what date and time that is. It's just, well, we'll let you know what date that is ahead of time so you can prepare. It might be at downtime. It'll definitely be at downtime. That's why I was like, it'll be at 11. I can tell you that. But all your broker's fields will be reimbursed. So you won't be kind of like out any money. And then when the new global flex market is there, you'll have to just relist the stuff.
00:41:19 So essentially the strategy is, if you've got loads of it already, just don't think about it. Market orders, that is. Don't think about it. You will get refunded because the company stopped dealing with what you tried to trade with. And you will need to relist on the day and it will show up in the Plex vault or in the Maturian station. Just when you go, oh, so it'll go directly back to your Plex vault. So you're not going to have to worry about items that are stuck anywhere. And then when you...
00:41:48 um just go to access it again um you'll it'll just be on the market as normal like you just type in plex on the market you'll click there and the only difference that you'll see is that you'll be able to see like through all the regions um and so when you buy you can just sort by price uh quantity that whole shebang so functionally nothing really changes apart from you just having to relist um and that's only from like a technical reason there's ccb master plan was trying to explain to me why
00:42:15 My eyes started to gloss over. I wasn't really sure. But I trust CZV Masterplan. If you got that name. Server proxies and things that needed to. It wasn't as. So it started with. What if it just to remove regions from the thing. You just don't show me. If market orders equals X. Just remove that part. What happens? It's more or less that. So the regional market is simply that. But obviously behind the scenes. There's like.
00:42:44 Sol nodes and server proxies and things that we're like, okay, I guess it's not that easy. But this is a toe in the water. It's not like a proper Forex exchange, but it's like a really good experimentation of how do people treat it? Does supply go up? Does demand go up? Does the price fluctuate? Do we get this deadplex on the market? Do we get more people interacting with it? Exactly. So it's just...
00:43:13 Really good. I think it's a great fourth step. So I want to close this off with a question to both of you. If we think about the concept of friction-free trade, and now I'm going to ask you to take off the hat if we are announcing something or we're just going to hypothesize from a personal perspective. What would be kind of the dream thing that would happen globally, frictionless, kind of on the market in the future?
00:43:42 Let's remove technical boundaries, like we were talking about, like the master crafters and stuff. What would kind of be the dream item just for you guys there? For trade? Yeah. For dream change. I think I'd like to figure out how blueprints work. Like blueprints are... Obviously not a digital item. Like these are hand drawn. Yeah, absolutely. When you go and copy a blueprint, there's just an army of...
00:44:09 Really good sketchers, just sketching up from the first one? Yeah, they roll out this paper. I think blueprints have... A lot of these conversations actually started around blueprints, because I was approached four or five years ago by a DevOps database engineer who told me, you know what is the biggest load on the server? It's calculating the state and ownership of every blueprint in the game. Does that include copies?
00:44:38 Yeah, because every researched or changed blueprint has become a singleton. So they're all stored as singletons. So they're the biggest load on the database. Even though there's probably a million million rockets, small copies. Exactly. So they're all crushing the server every morning. It's the biggest database job they run.
00:45:06 From any survival game. Like, if you treat EVE as kind of like, okay, how do blueprints work in normal, like normal, other games? You just get like a blueprint book, you find the blueprint, you have like, it goes into your book, so you can like, I'm gonna make this, I'm gonna make this, I'm gonna make this. Obviously EVE is harder, but we are storing blueprints, blueprint copies in containers, and it's all very archaic. It shouldn't be this hard. There's a lot of new players who never get the satisfaction of just like,
00:45:35 I'm going to make some ammo. I'm going to craft something. I have fun doing stuff. So I think this would... And the copies will be on contracts. They will not be on the market. Yes. So it should be the other way around, essentially, where the veterans that would be buying expensive blueprint originals to trade with or use as commodities or as a passive income. Yes. They could find it in the normal place. Exactly. So this becomes something that we can solve really well.
00:46:03 The only thing that we need to solve from a design perspective is like it is cool to lose blueprints. It's cool to have to move them and sometimes die. Especially with limited availability of industrial sites and stuff like that. But it's not necessarily for like a tech one MO stack or whatever. Like you need to just like have fun with it. So we've talked about like maybe there's a like you have to download like on the USB chip something if it's rare and you actually have to move that.
00:46:31 Kind of like taking a Plex from the vault and retaining a little bit of the fantasy of the loss. Because I think that is fun. But I think this would make a lot of stun stuff way more accessible and fun for a new player. I'm personally like a... I'm always a dwarf in games. And I like crafting and like resource gathering. So I'm like... Dwarfen too. Exactly. So it's just like...
00:46:58 I like doing this. I like having a recipe. I feel that it kind of marks my progression in some way, how many collections I have or whatever. So I think it's just like core to an MMORPG to have like oversight of my blueprints. And I think I'd love to try to fix that like by the end of this journey. It sounds like something that, you know, if we weren't this far in, could be redesigned basically from the ground up.
00:47:23 Aber das ist jetzt so ein integraler Teil des Spiels jetzt, so alles muss sich selbstverständlich sein. Und ich agree mit dem, weil ich auch, wenn ich die Kontrakte öffne, wenn ich da zwei bin, bin ich auf der Career-Programm. Ich glaube, ich habe eine gute Blueprint in da, aber wenn nicht, ich gehe in die Kontrakte und habe eine Blueprint-Kopie und eine Blueprint-Choice. Und dann, wenn ich die Kopie habe, ist es so...
00:47:50 10 runs, there's efficiency, there's time. There's like, why does this cost 10 times more than this? And it's not in a, like the market hub where I can see, you know, oh yeah, the item is, you know, 20% cheaper next door or whatever. And it's confusing and it's scary kind of. Very scary. What about you, Swit? Do you have something? Yeah, I mean, so I really love the idea of like a blueprint marketplace type thing.
00:48:18 And the way you were talking about it, this is also kind of how players try to arrange it themselves. Like they'll throw their very expensive Blueprint Originals into a station container inside a corp hanger with a very specific access. You can only read from it, can't really move it, but you can still kind of access it. So it's kind of already there. But really what I think would be really fun for the market, and this is something that you've talked about, Cicibiratati, is having...
00:48:47 Ja. Ja. Ja. Ja.
00:49:15 Ich denke, das würde öffnen, um, trading ein bisschen mehr. Especially in PlayerUnstrukturen, wo man könnte variety chosen by the players. Ja, ja, exactly. So, ja, maybe... And then you could have fun with, like, oh, maybe in Minmitar space, Minmitar ships, like, are a little bit taxed, a little bit less, and things like that. Yeah, if there's a specific goal that a group, a corporation, or a alliance, or something is trying to reach.
00:49:43 Is it a deployment in mining form or is it a war or something like that? Is there no tax on doctrine related stuff to either the mining or... Yeah. Makes sense. It's great. You're making a great case for a tax code change. Yeah, exactly. I struggle with this internally and externally to sell some of these tax code improvements.
00:50:06 Luxury tax, kind of like VAT in some way. Yeah, I kind of zoned out just the word tax. I'm not surprised. Yeah, it's not super sexy to be like, oh man. So where does that turn into exploding spaceships is all I want to know. That's the idea. Like a couple of accountants would probably get like really excited by it, but like our brand team is probably like, dude, what are you thinking about? Like we can't have a tax expansion. No, we start with the LP tax. LP taxes are impossible. Yes, we could.
00:50:34 Es wäre eine verrückte Art, um in der Welt zu gehen und zu sagen, dass die EVE-Economie so groß ist und so cool ist, dass wir eine besondere Anwendung für den Spiel über die Taxen gemacht haben. Ich mag es. Es ist ein Traum.
00:50:50 We're not going to do that. I think it's time for us to wrap this one up. Ratadi, Swift, thank you guys so much for coming around and explaining this. Now I don't need to read the devlog. I can just listen to, well, I don't need to listen to it again, but you know what I mean. But a fantastic overview of this, and I just look forward to seeing where and when these things hit, what it's actually going to impact right away. And Swift, you said we'll make sure to let everybody know.
00:51:17 Yeah, exactly. It'll be a news item to let you know what the dates are going to be. So you can kind of compare accordingly. But even if you don't, even if you're gone for like July 4th weekend or anything like that, you're going to get your fees back. So nothing functionally is going to change. You're not going to lose out on anything or anything like that. So you should be okay. Great. If you go touch grass for some weird reason. Yeah, why would you? Thanks so much, guys. And thank you all for listening. Anytime.